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#1 Judy M.

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Posted 19 April 2017 - 10:20 AM

I have been given a family tree that may or may not be related to mine. What would be the best way to add this family (several generations) to my info so that at some point, if we're able to find a connection, I can then merge this family into mine? Would I want a separate dataset that eventually can be merged into mine? If this family is related, it doesn't appear that there will be any duplication -- just that my 3rd great-grandfather may have had (or probably had!) siblings, one of which would be the head of the family tree I have been given. We're not sure yet how we're going to be able to determine this since that generation never came to the U.S.

Thanks in advance.


Judy Madnick
Albany, NY


#2 Terry Reigel

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Posted 19 April 2017 - 01:06 PM

Judy,

 

I think separate data sets are a pointless pain. I just add them in my regular dataset. I do mark them as not connected using Accents and my Connected Flag -- see Using Accent Colors -- so it is easy to see in the Picklist and elsewhere that they have not been connected to the rest of my people.


Terry

See my Tutorials and Articles on using TMG at tmg.reigelridge.com

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#3 Judy M.

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Posted 19 April 2017 - 02:16 PM

Thanks, Terry. So...the "new" family would be connected to each other and not my "known" family in any way; right? And if it turns out that they're not related to us, that family can't be deleted in one fell swoop because of their relationships to each other?

Of course, the other option is to simply not add them unless we find the connection!

 


Judy Madnick
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#4 Terry Reigel

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Posted 19 April 2017 - 06:44 PM

Thanks, Terry. So...the "new" family would be connected to each other and not my "known" family in any way; right?

 
Yes, that's the way I'd do it. Start by adding an "unrelated person" then add the rest of the family related to that person.
 

And if it turns out that they're not related to us, that family can't be deleted in one fell swoop because of their relationships to each other?

Well, you can always delete them if you decide to by moving them to a temporary data set, then deleting that data set. But why delete them? You may find reference to them in the future and if you keep them you will have the information to know they are not part of your line.
Terry

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The Second Edition of my book, A Primer for The Master Genealogist, is still available
. For more information see my website.

#5 Judy M.

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 06:58 AM

Sounds like a plan. Thanks!


Judy Madnick
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#6 Michael Hannah

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 01:25 PM

Hi, Judy,

 

I agree with Terry that these people should be included within your main project and dataset.  In addition I strongly agree with Terry's recommendation that you mark these people as a separate group by using a distinct Flag value.  For an excellent example see Terry's article about his Connected Flag:

http://tmg.reigelrid...m/connected.htm

 

As he suggests in that article, you "could" just create the Flag in your existing family dataset before you start adding the unconnected family, and set the values to "Y,N" so that all your existing people are marked by default as 'Y' (connected).  Now edit and change the defaults of this Flag to "N,Y" so that the new people you add are marked by default as 'N' (unconnected).  When you are done adding be sure to change the Flag default back to "Y,N" so that subsequent people will be marked connected by default.  I would also modify the Add Person template to be sure to include this Flag in that template so you can override the default if desired when you add someone.  I also second Terry's suggestion to use this Flag to set an accent color for these people.

 

However, since you indicate that this separate family tree is "many generations" it may be quite a large number of people?  If you think that adding them may be a lengthy process, and (more importantly) are likely to only do a few at a time, while also still working with your main family tree adding people to it as they are discovered, then I would recommend adding this family as a multi-step process.  I would actually add them into a separate temporary dataset in your main project.  However, note that Flags are unique to a dataset, so what you do with a Flag in one dataset does not affect any other dataset within that same project.  I would create a same-named Connected Flag in both datasets, but define the Flag defaults appropriately opposite in each dataset.  Then when you have finally completed adding the new family tree with all its generations, simply merge the temporary dataset into the main dataset, and delete the temporary dataset.

 

For merging I recommend you review Terry's Tips both about datasets and the merging of datasets:

http://tmg.reigelrid...ng.htm#datasets

 

So long as you have a Flag of the same name (e.g. Connected) in both datasets with the same possible values, even though their defaults may be different, the values already set for the merged-in people will be retained.  While you are still in the midst of adding this family bit by bit you don't have to think about the proper Flag values as you go back and forth working in both datasets.  Each dataset will set an added person to the appropriate default value.  Once merged the unconnected family will be in your main dataset but each person flagged as unconnected without further action.

 

This trick allows you to "slowly" add this new family while continuing to work with your main family, but always with the understanding and goal of ultimately merging the unconnected family into your main dataset.

 

Hope this gives you ideas,


Michael
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#7 Judy M.

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 09:21 AM

Before I get too confused -- :fear: -- what would be the downside of simply adding one unrelated person, connecting him/her with his/her family, and not use accents/flags?


Judy Madnick
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#8 Michael Hannah

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 10:05 AM

You "could" do that, Judy, and I am sure Terry will also respond, but I would want to be able to easily identify later which people are related and which are not.  For example, I may want to exclude the unrelated people from some reports, or produce a report of only the unrelated people, or exclude them from my Second Site web pages, etc.  If you ever want to be able to separately identify all these unrelated people it is much easier to mark them when you add them, than trying to identify them later.  So the "downside" which I see is a matter of the ease of separately identifying these people later.

 

Hope this helps,


Michael
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#9 Terry Reigel

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 06:34 PM

I agree totally with Michael. The downside is you loose the ability to tell easily which people are known to be related and which are not.


Terry

See my Tutorials and Articles on using TMG at tmg.reigelridge.com

The Second Edition of my book, A Primer for The Master Genealogist, is still available
. For more information see my website.

#10 Judy M.

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 08:25 AM

Hmmm...I already have some unrelated people in my data set (e.g., parents of those related by marriage). I guess I have a project ahead of me -- and a learning experience!


Judy Madnick
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#11 Judy M.

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 08:45 AM

Okay -- but I have to go through this process "CONNECTED flag" for each family...right? Or could I have chosen myself as the focus person? Can I edit what I've already done (using a relative as the focus person)?


Edited by Judy M., 22 April 2017 - 08:49 AM.

Judy Madnick
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#12 Terry Reigel

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 09:00 AM

Judy, 

 

My article on Connected Flags tells you how to set it for everyone who is already entered. Then you only have to manage it for new people that you add later.

 

However, in my definition, parents or siblings of spouses are still connected. So the method I describe will not mark them as un-connected. 


Terry

See my Tutorials and Articles on using TMG at tmg.reigelridge.com

The Second Edition of my book, A Primer for The Master Genealogist, is still available
. For more information see my website.

#13 Judy M.

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 09:32 AM

Hmmmm...I have to think about this.


Judy Madnick
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#14 Terry Reigel

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 12:54 PM

Judy,

 

Obviously, "connected" can mean whatever is helpful to you. My thinking is I want to know who I have entered because they have some link to the family, even by marriage, as opposed to people who I have entered because they have a name or some other attribute that caused me to wonder if there might be a connection, even though none has been proved.

 

So I include connections by marriage as "connected." I do not include people who I enter as Witnesses because a family member was living with them or had some other transaction when I've not found any blood or marriage connection. That serves my purposes, but yours may differ.


Terry

See my Tutorials and Articles on using TMG at tmg.reigelridge.com

The Second Edition of my book, A Primer for The Master Genealogist, is still available
. For more information see my website.

#15 Judy M.

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 03:15 PM

This would be easy if I were just starting out. But with a picklist of over 6,000 names (of course, that includes name variations) and 13 distinct families -- I dunno.

 

Hmmm...if I want to segregate just this one family group, could I enter one name, set up the Connected flag for that particular family and -- what would happen to all my other entries? More confusion!


Judy Madnick
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#16 Michael Hannah

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 05:36 PM

Some users define "Family Group" Flags as alternative to a "Connected" Flag.  Flag "FamA" is set to 'Y' for everyone in that family group, and 'N' for everyone else.  Then there is a "FamB" flag for that group, etc. etc.  Using separate family group flags allows a person to be in multiple groups.  Or you could simply have one Flag with multiple values: A,B,C,... But then a person could only be in one family group.

 

Hope this gives you ideas,


Michael
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#17 Judy M.

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Posted 23 April 2017 - 04:25 AM

If I have a Family Group for the family that so far isn't connected to an existing family, will it be totally isolated (i.e., won't print when I print reports)? And if we eventually find that that Family Group is part of our existing family, would it be easy to "attach" it?


Judy Madnick
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#18 Terry Reigel

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Posted 23 April 2017 - 05:04 AM

What reports?

 

If you create an Ancestors or Descendants report that starts with someone in an existing family, of course people who are not part of that family will not appear in it.

 

Other types of reports will include everyone who is specified by the way you define the report, so could well include people not in your existing family. For example, if you created a List of People report for everyone with any event in New York, it could well include people not in the family.

 

Attaching a family group to the existing family is simple. Create a Parent/Child Relationship Tag or a Marriage Tag with a person in the main family and the appropriate person in the formerly unrelated family. Now they are connected.


Terry

See my Tutorials and Articles on using TMG at tmg.reigelridge.com

The Second Edition of my book, A Primer for The Master Genealogist, is still available
. For more information see my website.

#19 Judy M.

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Posted 23 April 2017 - 06:11 AM

I think I like the Family Group idea. Is there a shortcut for choosing the "Family Goup" flag?


Judy Madnick
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#20 Michael Hannah

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Posted 23 April 2017 - 10:09 AM

Is there a shortcut for choosing the "Family Goup" flag?

 
Not really., Judy  By your questions I suspect? that you have not used Flags before?  In my opinion they are one of the most powerful and useful features of TMG.  Perhaps it would be worth your time to begin by reviewing (again?) Terry's Tips about Flags here.  Then review Terry's descriptions of both his Related-by Flags and his Connected Flag mentioned earlier.  I also have an entire section on Flags (including several ideas for custom Flags) in the Style chapter of my on-line book.
 
The "Family Group" Flag concept (described by several users over time) is similar to Terry's two Flags mentioned above but slightly different, and is only one of many ideas for custom Flags used regularly by TMG users.  As I suggested earlier, there are two main definitions which I recall being mentioned by users, but are likely many more.  How you "set" the values of these Flags involves the same basic actions as how you set any Flag.
 
Definition one: Separate Flag for each family group.
Multiple custom Flags are created each with a unique name indicating a specific family group.  Values are (N,Y).  For example, you might have groups for Jones, Smith, and Baker, so you might define three separate Flags: JONES, SMITH, and BAKER.  A person belonging to a given family group (however the user chooses to define "belong") has that group's Flag set to 'Y'.  All other people by default are 'N'.
Advantages: a person can potentially "belong" to multiple family groups, i.e. they could have more than one of these Flags set to 'Y'.  This multiple assignment ability helps when family groups intermarry.
Disadvantages: the user has many more different Flags to ensure each one is set appropriately.
 
Definition two: Single Flag to identify the one family group to which this person belongs.
A single custom Flag is defined with a name indicating its purpose (e.g. FAMGRP).  The default value is '?' but multiple possible values are defined for this one Flag, each unique letter identifying a separate family group.  For example, you might have lines for Jones, Smith, and Baker, so you might define the Flag values as: ( ?,J,S,B ).  A person belonging to a given family group (e.g. Jones) has this Flag set to the value of their family group (e.g. 'J').  All unassigned people by default are '?'.
Advantages: only one Flag needs to be set to identify that person's membership in their one primary family group.
Disadvantages: the user must choose which one group a person "belongs" to in light of an intermarriage.
 
How to set Flags
These actions are the same no matter what type of custom Flag is defined.  The set of defined Flags in a dataset exists for all People, but each person has their separate value assigned for each Flag.  When the Flag is created, or when a person is added, each person has their Flag(s) set to its default value.  Either the user changes the default value(s) of the Flag(s) one-by-one for each person, most likely when the person is added, or some method is used to identify a desired group of people and then a report is run filtered for that group to set the Flag to a specific value for all people in the group all at once.

 

Groups can be identified by selecting people on the Project Explorer possibly using a filter, or adding people to a Focus Group possibly using its ancestor/descendant feature.  Once a group is identified, the Secondary Output of a List of People report filtered for that group can set their Flag to a given value at once for all those people.  A group can also be identified by appropriate filters on a List of Event reports, whose Secondary Output can set their Flag to a given value for people associated with those events.  It may take multiple actions to define all members of a group: one action may only be able to identify some, other actions identify more to be added to the group, etc.

 

Conclusion

There is no magic shortcut to setting Flag values.  You must identify to TMG the appropriate people, and either set their Flag to a given value individually or as a group.  It is because there is no magic shortcut that I suggested setting any appropriate Flags when you add the people, as that action is already dealing with each person so setting the Flags for each person becomes easier.

 

Hope this gives you a better idea of what Terry and I are suggesting concerning defining and setting Flags.


Michael
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