Mike Talbot

Clever. Very nice! Keep those ideas coming.

Thanks again, Virginia,

The issue within the VCf usage is that independent of whether you can create a marriage between 2 persons, that is only half the story. It is my belief that VCF will show such primary same gender relationships in a descendancy-based chart, but it requires both the primary mother and primary father links to be present for male-male or female-female families with children. That is, one person of a couple must be designated as the primary father and the other as the primary mother of the child for the links to show on the chart. This is one of the consequences of using a methodology to represent something for which it was not designed.

 

Gender/sex of members of a relationship, the family structure and the genetic relationships get confused. No charting software that I know adequately and distinctly deals with this same-gender problem or the problem of showing both birth and adoptive parents on the same chart. The reality is that such family structure are becoming more common. An agreed method of handling more than one parent of a given gender needs to be agreed on before most software can chart this. Of course, the question of multiple primary parents of the same gender has implications on all sorts of internals within the software so the issue is not easy to fix.

I do agree, completely, if you settle for the unedited TMG chart output.

As you have previously mentioned, VCF makes it so easy to modify your chart to the way you want it. In the original topic under discussion, it would be quick and painless to hand-edit a chart to what is desired.

Best wishes,

Mike,

 

Re: "Most of human recorded history occurred BC."

 

I don't think that's accurate. Most of human history occured B.C., but most of it was not recorded.

I rest my case, as you indicate.

Recorded history began beyond 3000 years BC. Only about 2009.03 years have been recorded since BC.

Recorded history can be measured by the length of the period covered, not just the number of written words that have, somehow, miraculously survived the ages from BC. No one can even guess at the volume of recorded history that has been lost. The library at Alexandria was but a small percentage of those ancient treasures destroyed. Never the less, much did survive.

Do we just differ in semantics? Or...Is it your opinion that BC dates might just as well remain unsupported by TMG?

I remain an avid fan of TMG. There is no harm intended in wishing that it were better.

Respectfully,

TMG does not handle years before 1 A.D. and struggles with the first century A.D. years before 101, as it wants me to "fix" the century, but finally accepts a year from 0001 through 0100.

 

There was no year zero, which messes up the continuity, but we are aware of that. 46 B.C. (year of confusion of 445 days before the Julian calendar started in 45 B.C.) introduces more fun, along with inconsistencies of setting early Julian leap years.

 

I put B.C. dates in the memo field as do most people. I did find that I can separate these from other unknown dates or no date at all by entering "b 0001" (before 0001) in the date field. That helps a little and gives these a catagory separate from later A.D. years at least.

 

I don't see any reference to what version 8 will do about this, but it's still early. The preliminary file of what it will do is still in the overview stage.

Once again, I second this wish for TMG support of BC dates. As mentioned before, several of my historian and DFA genealogist friends have rejected using TMG due to this shortcomming. Most of human recorded history occurred BC.

While an elegant treatment of BC is desired, something simple like negative year support would be far better than what we have. Sure, selected elapsed time calculations might be off by 1 year, but that's far better than being off by thousands.

Best wishes,

TMG will not deal with a marriage unless between a man and a woman.

Not true. TMG will give you a Warning that the sexes of both parties are the same, but there is nothing to prevent the creation of a TMG Marriage tag between two people of the same sex. You would probably want to create some custom roles and/or sentences for such a tag, but TMG will deal with this just fine.

 

Agreed. TMG also supports a 3rd sex = unknown. You can also , obviously, have any number of multiple marriages.

Any type of strange marriages can be recorded in TMG. Any, even biologically impossible, parentages are also supported.

Enjoy.

Best wishes,

Just reloaded TMG v7 to a new hardrive and restored saved projects. When checking for a Update from the project receiving the following error:

"Exception Processing Message c0000013 Parameters 75b6bf7c 4 75b6bf7c".

 

What is the problem and how is it fixed?

Sorry, I can't help with the bad news.

The good news...When you download a copy of TMG, you get the latest (7.04) version. No need to check for an update.

Good luck,

I am having trouble getting a child adopted to show up in the family on a journal report

Here is what I have done:

The child "Dylan" is Tims new wife's from a previous marriage.

For Dylan I have a tag called "Name-Adopted" and the sentence is "Upon adoption he was named [N] <[M]>"

and a tag called "Name-Birth" and the sentence is "[PP] birth name was [N] <[M]>"

and the tag "Father-Ado"

 

For the adoptive father "Tim" I have the tag "Son-Ado" with Dylan as the son.

also a tag called "Adopted" and the role of "Adoptor" and the sentence is "He <and [P2]> adopted [RG:Adoptee]< [M]><[D]><[L]>"

Dylan's birth surname is inserted in the memo field

Dylan is the "Adoptee"as listed in the sentence of "Adoptor"

 

My problem, when I do a journal report Dylan does not show up in Tim's family, Dylan's mother does, Dylan is now his son so how can I accomplish this?

 

I sure need some help here

Thanks in advance

Kenny

It is assumed that you are using the standard tags...Father-Ado and Son-Ado, and the son also has a standard tag of Father-Bio.

I, too, fall into that category.

Only one father in the parent group can be designated as Primary at any one time. The son will only appear in the reports or charts associated with the primary Father.

You can change the Primary Father designation to whichever family on which you are reporting.

or

As an example of what I do, I keep my bio father as primary. When I gen a descendant chart on my adoptive family, I gen. a chart on myself and copy my chart into my adoptive fathers chart, edit the composite chart as needed. In that case, I connect myself to my adoptive parents with a dotted line.

In defense of this difficulty with TMG (reports and charts), it is a genealogy (biological) program, not a legalality one.

Hope this helps,

New website address:

http://LAgenealogy.net/default.aspx

The old, impossible to remember, address will still work.

Best wishes,

I see V.8 is on its way. Can I again register my perennial request that the developers include the facility to include symbols - either triangle and squares or gender symbols (ideally both) - into charts and reports. For those of us working mostly with non-anglo-saxon genealogies, these are essential as names alone do not indicate a person's gender to an anglo-saxon audience; likewise in upper generations where often a person's name is no longer recalled or known, except for colour coding (which is not much use for black and white re-productions), there is no automatic way that a person's gender can be conveniently shown on charts.

<snip>

BTW, on the lighter side:

Gender is a grammatical concept.

When referring to biology, the proper word is sex.

It will also get you many more hits from Google. <g>

Happy New Year,

My daughter, Kris (also my web expert), introduced me to a different PDF file generator. It easily works well, it’s free and installs as a printer under Windows XP. Once installed, it is automatically accessible as a printer by VCF and MSWord to generate PDF files of your TMG (output to word-processor file) reports and VCF charts.

CutePDF Writer is available at:

http://download.cnet.com/3001-20_4-10206470.html?spi=6d88b8aa42647edc82795a5b6938ab16

Install it in Windows XP. It will then be automatically available to MSWord and VCF as a printer. Don’t know about direct TMG printing, yet. I never print reports directly from TMG. Always print to a Word file for hand editing before printing.

There are PDF paging problems with non-letter or non-legal size VCF large charts. Otherwise, you get good Charts in PDF format. The PDF-VCF charts take about half the file space of the same charts in JPG format.

I always had trouble with PDF files, so have avoided using them. So far, CutePDF Writer has been trouble free, if you stay within its vs. VCF’s limitations.

PDF fans, give it a try,

I second your wish. There are many grandfathers named Marie or Anne and grandmothers named Claude or Philippe, etc.

 

Also wish that the optional sex symbol could be a corner of the box, so that it does not use up any valuable chart real-estate. A user definable box color based on sex might also be nice, but would not help for b/w charts.

 

Best wishes,

 

I agree that VCF should include the facility for displaying boxes with gender symbols.

 

In 2007 Robin made available for download a collection of 6 custom frames, including some with gender symbols. The thread is here. A screenshot of the frames is below:

 

 

Note that the instructions for copying the frames to TMG v7 are in message #5 in that thread.

 

Virginia

Thanks, Virginia. As you and Robin have demonstrated, it is impossible to draw a true circle or curved or non-horizontal or non-vertical lines in VCF. The smaller the drawn object, the worse it looks.

What we wish for are true symbols, at printer resolution, that will vary with and be compatible with box size. For color, it should be the box border or shadow color. The box fill color is more valuable for other user desired purposes (thanks again for showing us how to easily color fill VCF boxes).

Best wishes (pun intended),

I second your wish. There are many grandfathers named Marie or Anne and grandmothers named Claude or Philippe, etc.

Also wish that the optional sex symbol could be a corner of the box, so that it does not use up any valuable chart real-estate. A user definable box color based on sex might also be nice, but would not help for b/w charts.

Best wishes,

Merry Christmas to all genealogy fans and their relatives and friends.

This e-mail Christmas card took less than 15 minutes to edit in VCF, once the content was decided upon. That includes 2 versions, one for relatives and close friends, the other with some personal details deleted. The deciding (stare and contemplate the raw TMG chart) took at least an hour. Printed, the card is 10.5 x 6.5 inches.

Best wishes,

Terry,

 

I don't see that they are a generation later. They are just in a different group. They wouldn't be in the "Great-Grandparents" group because they aren't any sort of "parents." They are appropriately labeled as "aunts/uncles." The report is organized primarily by relationship, not by generations. The arrangement seems to be:

 

1. Parents, then their descendants of various degree, arranged by generation

 

2. Next older generation of ancestors, then their descendants, arranged by generation

 

3. Next older generation of ancestors, then their descendants, arranged by generation

 

4. etc.

I agree with TerryR, the relationship category descriptions are accurate.

I also agree with TerryD, the report is most-confusing. It is of no value to me, other than counting how many people are in a particular relative category. Strangely, descendants of the subject come at the end of the report. People within a category are often in a nonsense order. There is no way to positively tie a spouse or children to the proper persons, etc. This is especially true when multiple spouses are involved.

Let's hope that WG redesigns this report with more sensible ordering and codes to positively link people to their spouses and kids to their parents. 'Til then, thumbs down on this report.

TMG 7.04 Windows 7 64 bit

 

Got a big problem.

I created a focus group of my relation as follows: Added my father, highlighted him and did his ancestors, more than he has, highlighted all, did all their descendants, more than they have, highlighted all and added spouse's, highlighted all and add one Ancestor.

Then I created a flag and run list of people and secondary output used the flag I created to set that focus group to the flag to a Y.

So Far So Good, I thought.

I have found several families so far that are like this, of a father being my 2nd cousin and only 2 out of his 5 children show up with a Y in the flag, if 2 of his children are my 3rd cousin why isn't the other three.

Also when I run 2nd site I miss some more of naturally other families.

Do I have a timing problem?

 

Sure would like some help with this

Thanks

Kenny

I'm not sure that I understand the reason for all this (I guess you're eliminating your mother's family), but:

Are all of the parent/child relationship tags set to Primary? Any that were not primary would be skipped.

Good luck,

<snip>____________________________________________________________________

 

The second attached chart is of medium complexity and will take the better part of an hour to do. It is basically the above chart with all siblings and their spouses added. In addition to moving the generations to overlap, you must also move boxes across generations to make room for the siblings and spouses to be copied from the descendant chart. Then import and position picture and enter explanatory text as per the simple chart, above.

 

<snip>

Forgot to mention:

Where space is tight, you can easily overlap and squeeze down the size of some boxes to force them to fit. You can also edit the text within the boxes and add data not supported in standard VCF chart generation.

I've been away from TMG and especially VCF for some time.

The version of VCF that I have is 3.2.0.13

Is this the latest version.

 

John.

It's the same as mine (on TMG7.04).

My understanding is that if you are on the latest version of TMG, you also have the latest VCF.

After that unexpected sidetrack, this message will complete the planned topic of holiday composite charts. There are two attached letter size charts, one simple and one of medium complexity.

Let’s start with a simple composite 5 generations ancestor chart, with added spouse. It will be made to fit on letter size paper (8.5 x 11 inches). See the first attachment. It is a composite of an ancestor and a descendant chart. The VCF work can be done in a minute (after a bit of practice).

With the ancestor chart open in VCF, zoom-to-fit, group select the 4 oldest generations, move them left, with mouse, to overlap the subject. Then group select the oldest 3 generations, move them left until the oldest generation fits the page horizontally. You will see that connector lines cross over the subject and parents boxes. Select those boxes and click on move to front, the boxes will now cover the lines.

Then, open the descendant chart, select and copy the spouse box.

Return to the ancestor chart and paste the spouse, then move it to the desired location. Then import the two external pictures and trim the chart. Your minute is up. Adding explanatory text is easy, but can take as much time as you choose spend in composition. You can copy text from your TMG files and paste it into VCF text boxes. Fini.

____________________________________________________________________

The second attached chart is of medium complexity and will take the better part of an hour to do. It is basically the above chart with all siblings and their spouses added. In addition to moving the generations to overlap, you must also move boxes across generations to make room for the siblings and spouses to be copied from the descendant chart. Then import and position picture and enter explanatory text as per the simple chart, above.

Now place 2 completed letter size charts of your choosing, back-to-back, in a transparent plastic sheet protector and give it to your folks. Any comments or questions?

Enjoy VCF,

I've clicked on every parameter, found, that claims to control the browser and can find no parameter that says it is associated with an automatic "zoom to fit" option.

 

IE 8

 

Tools > Internet Options > Advanced tab > Multimedia > Enable automatic image resizing - deselect

 

The Multimedia section is quite a way down the list so scroll down until you find it.

Wow!!! So easy and worked like a champ. Big attachments look and act great, again, like on old computer.

If you ever visit in New Orleans, may I take you to lunch? No expiration date on offer.

Thank you so much,

Mike -

 

Could the viewing problem be from your browser? With Firefox I see the first screen at 22%, then hover over the chart and get the magnifying glass icon which enlarges the chart to a reasonable legible size that is scrollable.

 

It's a beautiful chart - really a work of art.

 

Thank you for sharing.

 

Virginia

 

Virginia - I experienced the same problem as Mike (forwhat it is worth). I am using IE 8 with Win7 so it might still be browser related - don't know.

Thanks, Virginia and rlgleason51, every idea helps. I just noticed the attachment display problem this AM.

I should have mentioned that I had to get a new computer, 4 months ago. I paid extra to get the latest version of XP to avoid the Vista fiasco. I use the latest xp version of the MS internet explorer as browser. I've clicked on every parameter, found, that claims to control the browser and can find no parameter that says it is associated with an automatic "zoom to fit" option.

Hope someone can point me in the right direction for a fix. Or, tell me that's just the way it now is, so get over it.

BTW, Virginia, the new computer, latest XP version and browser fixed the unreasonable limit on the size of attachment files that I could upload to this forum. How? It's a mystery. Thanks again for helping me to get around that in the past.

Best wishes,

There seems to be a new problem with the attachment viewer for this forum (or is it me?). It displays the image, nicely, then immediately does a “zoom to fit” on the display page.

An icon at the lower right of the page allows one to see the zoomed image at 200% (too small) or 400% (too big).

Is there a way to defeat the new “zoom to fit” undesirable feature for attachments? The old way to view the attachment at actual size, and scroll around big attachments was great

It's not too early to plan a VCF genealogy chart to attach to family Christmas presents. A VCF chart can serve as a present to those whom you usually just send a card or e-mail, also.

Family related genealogy charts are enjoyed by all and appreciated by most. Importing a few photos and adding some supporting text enhances the value of any VCF chart.

The attached example chart was picked for its diverse complexity and is 8.5 x 31 inches. It is a Yours/Mine/Ours descendants chart with a line of descent thrown in. It is a composite of two standard VCF descendant charts and two ancestor charts, and took a bit over two hours to construct.

Sure, you could construct it from one huge standard hourglass chart. But, a composite of multiple smaller charts is far, far easier to do.

For details of the techniques involved in constructing and coloring composite charts and moving the components to where you want them, see previous posts by Virginia, Robin and me on this forum.

The attached example chart is intended to show many possibilities. A chart of this complexity is not recommended for a "maiden voyage" in VCF custom editing.

If you keep (or move components to fit) your charts down to letter size or legal size paper, placing one or two-back-to-back charts in transparent sheet protectors is a nice touch. You can also e-mail any reasonably sized chart (export to JPG format recommended).

Best wishes,

Mike,

 

Are you being confused by a message from VFI that says "checking for principals that are not witnesses"? I would guess that the meaning of that message is, as Jim keeps repeating, all principals should be witnesses and this check is making sure that they are.

Yes I was, thank you for the translation.

Now, may I translate my previous question: Evidently, such an error is not severe, since my TMG functioned fine for years with hundreds of thousands of them. Since no more of this type error has been found on my TMG in more years, and checking for them takes up an annoying half+ of the long VFI run time, can that check be eliminated or circumvented sometime in the future?

Thanks, again,

This falls under the "why".

 

Why is 90% of the time spent in my file validation process (hours) consumed on checking witnesses, even though there aren't any to speak of (< 10)?

 

It's checking for principals that are not witnesses at the moment.

Over half the time consumed by VFI on my data is on checking for principals that are not witnesses. The time taken is very annoying. (moderate size dataset of about 83,000 persons)

When this check was added a couple of years ago it found and fixed over 100,000 errors the first time it was run. Since then it has found no error. This check should be removed or made into a preferences option.

Best wishes,

Good explanation--thanks. Minor problem--Charles and Mary are the last visible generation and Gladys is the first invisible. TMG won't let me toggle the primary link off betweem Charles and Mary and Gladys.

If there are any parents in a person's record, one and only set must be primary. TMG will allow each person to have as many parents or sets of parents as you choose.

For your example, define a DUMMY set of additional parents named something like Charles* and Mary* for Gladys and make them primary. Your Charles and Mary will then automatically be assigned as non-primary by TMG. Do the same for any other problem people.

A rub might come if there are many other people already in your database that also fall into the restricted area. Diplomacy is the desired cure for that one.

Hope this works out for you,