Godparents-godchildren links

[gregharper 0]

Apologies if (i) this has been dealt with before and/or (ii) if I'm just being dumb, but I just tried to enter a godmother-godson relationship as an Event in TMG, using the built-in Mother-God and Son-God Tags. The software then asked if I wanted it to create a marriage between the godmother and the boy's father! Even if you say no to this, the program creates a blood-line relationship. Of course, this is a nonsense so I deleted the entries and created my own custom Tag where I could record this relationship in a "neutral" way but still have it in both individuals' series of life events and family history. I feel it is worth including this as an Event because it can show that two families were close and this in turn can help understand other ways in which they may have interacted, including through marriage, common migration patterns, similar occupations, etc.

 

Is there a way to avoid the godparent/child Tags creating a blood-line relationship? It seems to me that this is actually mis-programming (I haven't explored if the other options like Adopted and Foster do the same!). Any suggestions would be very welcome. Thank you!

 

Best wishes,

 

Greg

[dadempsey 0]

You can define a role and add the people as witnesses to the baptism with that role, or just override the witness sentence for that entry. Which would work best depends on how many times you'd do this.

 

My understanding is that witness/role information doesn't export well, if at all, to other geneaology programs, but I'm no expert.

[JohnR 0]

Is there a way to avoid the godparent/child Tags creating a blood-line relationship? It seems to me that this is actually mis-programming (I haven't explored if the other options like Adopted and Foster do the same!). Any suggestions would be very welcome. Thank you!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Thos problem has been around I think since TMG for DOS days and I was promised a cure back then

[Terry Reigel 0]

I just tried to enter a godmother-godson relationship as an Event in TMG, using the built-in Mother-God and Son-God Tags. The software then asked if I wanted it to create a marriage between the godmother and the boy's father! Even if you say no to this, the program creates a blood-line relationship.

All the parent/child tags are really the same thing. The different labels are only for your use in the Person View. If any of the parent/child tags are marked as Primary, they will behave as if the relationship is a blood relationship.

Is there a way to avoid the godparent/child Tags creating a blood-line relationship?

In my view the godparent tags are a poor way to record this relationship. Rather, I'd suggest adding the godparents as witnesses to the child's baptism tag as suggested by dadempsey. Probably the best way to do this is to create godparent roles in that tag type, so you can more easily reflect the roles they played, both in their own narratives and those of the child.

[gregharper 0]

Thanks, guys, for the suggestion re witness roles in the baptism Tag - that's an elegant and effective solution to what I am trying to do! So that's one problem solved.

 

Thank you again,

 

Best wishes,

 

Greg

[betsymil 0]

(I haven't explored if the other options like Adopted and Foster do the same!). Any suggestions would be very welcome. Thank you!

 

I am using the Father-Ado and Mother-Ado tags for an ancestor. How do I get those tags to print in reports? Everything I have tried only shows the Biological parents. I want to show the Adopted parents also. I don't have an Adoption tag as I don't know that there was ever a formal adoption. I also want the children to show on reports of the Adopted parents. How do you do this?

 

Thanks!

Betsy

[Jim Byram 0]

I am using the Father-Ado and Mother-Ado tags for an ancestor. How do I get those tags to print in reports? Everything I have tried only shows the Biological parents. I want to show the Adopted parents also. I don't have an Adoption tag as I don't know that there was ever a formal adoption. I also want the children to show on reports of the Adopted parents. How do you do this?

Please read Terry's response above where both of your questions were answered.

[John Cardinal 0]

Thos problem has been around I think since TMG for DOS days and I was promised a cure back then

I'd be surprised if you were "promised a cure." The system works as designed; if you want a godparent to be treated as a blood relative, then you use the God- relationship tag. If you do not want to create a blood relationship, then you do not use the God- tag. Instead, you can add witnesses to the Birth or Baptism or some other tag.

 

For an adoptive parent, the same basic rules apply. In that case, however, you would add an Adoption event where the adoptive parents are witnesses.

[betsymil 0]

For an adoptive parent, the same basic rules apply. In that case, however, you would add an Adoption event where the adoptive parents are witnesses.

 

No, it didn't answer my question. I don't care whether it creates a blood-relationship or not. I just want a Family Group Sheet that shows something like:

Father: xxxxx

Mother: xxxxx

Father-Ado: xxxx

Mother-Ado: xxxx

 

I also want the children to be listed like the other children are on the adoptive parents' report. If those tags don't ever print, why bother ever using them at all?

 

I don't have an Adoption event because I do not know that they were adopted for sure as they were "taken in" and took the last name of the family that took them. I don't have a date for when this occured. If adopted children are every much part of the family as birth children are, why treat them as a "witness to an event" rather than as "real" children.

 

Betsy

[Michael Hannah 0]

The issue of dealing with adoption and other non-biological parental-like relationships is often discussed. This really involves the issue of whether TMG should be a "genealogy" program (i.e. tracing genetic/biological links) or should be a "family history" program (i.e. recording and reporting all events of families regardless of biological linkage). Of course the answer is yes it should be both. Yet the program has to make some assumptions that are based on long-standing historical usage of genealogical programs and reports. In its current implementation TMG allows only one primary "father" and one primary "mother" per person, and those parents are the only ones used for ancestor and descendant linkages. In the case of the Family Group Sheet, that is a standardized report that only defines one father and one mother. I don't use that report very much so can't think of a way to include the adoptive parents. Maybe someone else will have an idea for that report.

 

However, TMG is very good at being able to be customized to record and report almost anything about a person. It is just that some of the reports are restricted to standard output, like the Family Group Sheet. In the case of Adoptions many custom tags and sentences and methods have been proposed over the years by TMG users. For example, you might search this Forum using the keyword Adoption, and in particular look at my more complex suggestion in the Sentences Structures section of this Forum.

 

Hope this gives you ideas,

[Terry Reigel 0]

I don't care whether it creates a blood-relationship or not. I just want a Family Group Sheet that shows something like:

Father: xxxxx

Mother: xxxxx

Father-Ado: xxxx

Mother-Ado: xxxx

A family group sheet is a long-time traditional format in genealogy, and it has never recognized multiple sets of parents. TMG's implementation of that report does not go beyond the traditional format. Other TMG reports, such as the narratives, are more adaptable to customization.

I also want the children to be listed like the other children are on the adoptive parents' report.

You can do that. You just have to make the adoptive relationship tags primary, and, as John said, they will be treated as blood relationships.

If those tags don't ever print, why bother ever using them at all?

Relationship tags never print - they are used to control how parent and child relationships are displayed in reports that include that information. And, since all reports only allow each child to have one set of parents, only those relationship tags that are made primary will be used. You can, however, make a report with one set of tags made primary, then make another set primary and make a report showing those relationships.

I don't have an Adoption event because I do not know that they were adopted for sure as they were "taken in" and took the last name of the family that took them. I don't have a date for when this occurred.

Then use another Tag Type to describe the relationship, even make up a custom one if you like. You can create tags to say anything you want about such cases. But tags that describe the relationship, like the Adoption tag, are for explaining, while Relationship tags are for controlling how relationships are displayed.

If adopted children are every much part of the family as birth children are, why treat them as a "witness to an event" rather than as "real" children.

If you want them to be shown as part of the family, make the adoptive relationship tag primary, as I suggested above.